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Izbjegavajući poremećaj


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#161 BurnInHell

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 11:11

Empatija...da li to uopste i postoji? Ili je vise zato sto zelimo da verujemo da postoji, zato sto nam tako prosto prija?
Radije bih da neko bude mega iskren nego da se pravi da me ne povredi...dokle vise da bezimo u iluzije? Ako zaista zelim da se promenim, dozvolicu svoj toj lavini, koliko god bila bolna da se obrusi na mene, a oni koji zele da spavaju i vicu za svaku neprijatnost, ni ne zele da se promene.
Skroz sam sada skrenula sa teme...ovo nema ni veze sa ovim videom.... prsla sam....

#162 Tovar

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 13:54

Pa dobro, nisam vidio neki poseban razlog da onaj video dobije toliko dislajkova. Možda je malo nedostajalo da se stavi u perspektivu osobe sa ADP, a ne njihovog okruženja. Jer ipak je osoba sa APD ta koja u kontinuitetu na određeni način pati, a ostali se mogu maknuti od nje ako im ne odgovara. Nisam siguran koliko je osuđivala ljude sa APD, a koliko su se neki pronašli u tome pa lupali dislajkove, teško je reći.

Ali pronalazim se. Evo prije 4 sata kad sam krenuo na posao bio sam sposoban koliko-toliko funkcionirati. Sad, nakon 4 sata sjedenja sa još četvero ljudi, i to bez previše direktne konverzacije, ne znam kud udaram, totalno sam pogubljen.

#163 VanjaCro

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 16:31

po meni je to najbolje poslusati iz perspektive osobe koja ima slican problem
decko jako dobro skida ovaj poremecaj isto kroz malo humora ali dosta je realan i vidi svoj poremecaj na nacin na koji ga vidi



#164 Tovar

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 17:10

E ovo je pravo objašnjenje iz prve ruke. Pronašao sam se odmah u prva 2 moguća uzroka koja je naveo na 1:20. Vrijeđanje u školi i odnos s ocem.

#165 BurnInHell

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 17:46

Odlican video

#166 Ninche

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 23:50

Hm, kao sto Tovar kaze... Mada, odnos sa ocem nemam od 9-te godine, jer mi je tad umro. Ali, desava mi se da sanjam snove u kojima nas je on ostavio i ima drugu porodicu... Mada, verovatno sad ovo sto sam napisala nije relevatno. Ali, odbijanje da izadjem napolje, cak i u ducan koji je nekoliko koraka udaljen od moje zgrade, to mi se desavalo. I desava vecinom vremena i dalje. Jos kad sam morala da idem u tu radnju (sad ne idem vise vecinom vremena), osecala sam kao da trgovkinje misle da sam narkomanka. Jos mi se desavalo nebrojeno puta da mi drhte ruke pred njima, da se zabunim sto se tice sume novca koju dam, da se mucim da izvadim pare iz novcanika itd.

Mozda me sad prolazi, sta znam. Pocela sam da se javljam na poruke ljudi koji su mi bitni, da ne izbegavam npr. da otvorim poruku na fb jer bi onda pisalo "seen".
Raspisah se ovde bezveze i znam da je off-topic, ali cu da post-ujem, jer sam se raspisala.
Imam blazi oblik, to je sigurno, uz zavisni poremecaj licnosti, jedino sto ovo drugo, kad sam napisala ovde da to imam, su svi otpisali kao "nije to nista", a ovde se razglaba o ovoj temi danima.

#167 archaic_tiger

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 12:54

View PostNinche, on 23 April 2017 - 23:50 , said:

Imam blazi oblik, to je sigurno, uz zavisni poremecaj licnosti, jedino sto ovo drugo, kad sam napisala ovde da to imam, su svi otpisali kao "nije to nista", a ovde se razglaba o ovoj temi danima.

Ja,evo recimo,ni najmanje ne smatram da je ZPL "ništa"...Ne znam ko ti je takvo nešto rekao,ali ako mene pitaš-pogrešio je.

#168 VanjaCro

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 09:27

postati cu u ovaj topic posto je nekako vezano neka admin odvoji ako misli da treba u zaseban topic
otkrivena razlika izmedu AvPD i SA (na engleskom nazalost) pokusao sam da prevedem ali odustao

avoidant personality disorder (avpd) is charactorized by pervasive behavioural, emotional and cognitive avoidance.

SOCIAL AVOIDANCE:

an avoidant's fears of social situation evolve around fears of criticism, rejection and ridicule, feelings of inadequacy and the veiw that the self is socially inept or inferior to others.
the manifestation of these fears is usually a result of repeated criticism, ridicule and rejection, in early childhood, from significant others such as peers or parents or both. avoidants beleive that becasue they were rejected, ridiculed and criticised that they are somehow not good enough, not likeable and that they are somehow bad. therefore they have an expectation that all other people will see that they are bad, inferior, unloveable etc... and that they will reject them because of this. this results in the assumption that exposure of the ''real self'' to others or assertive self expression will be met with rejection.

For avoidants it seems dangerous to be in positions were they can be evaluated because their perception of negative or even neutral reactions from others confirms beleifs that they are unlikeable. an avoidants self concious feelings, that are frequently experienced in social situations, is more to do with trying ones best to not express the self or to reveal any part of the real self or to do anything wrong that would result in rejection, ridicule or criticism from others, unlike social phobics who are self concious because they are trying to prevent other people from noticing their physical symptoms of anxiety like blushing, shaking, sweating etc....

An avoidant's social avoidance is usually apparent. less obvious is their cognitive and emotional avoidance, in which they avoid thinking about things that lead to dyphoric feelings. their low tolerance for dyphoria also leads them to distract themselves behaviourally from negative cognitions.

COGNITIVE, BEHAVIOURAL AND EMOTIONAL AVOIDANCE

(DYSPHORIA means any negative emotion or uncomfortable feelings e.g anxiety, sadness, irritation, boredom etc....)

Avoidants have a low threshold for dysphoric emotions therefore they avoid any activity that makes them feel uncomfortable. they even avoid thinking about anything that produces dysphoric emotions.
the reason for an avoidants low threshold for dysphoria is usually becasue they hold beleifs that unpleasant thoughts or emotions are intorable ''i can't handle strong feelings'' ''it's bad to feel bad'' ''if i let my feelings become unbottled i'll be overwhelmed'' etc...
the reason for these beleifs usually stems from the person's childhood, a time when these beleifs were relevant i.e a young child experiening all kinds of negative emotions such as rejection, ridicule, worthlesness etc... would obviously be expected to beleive that they cannot handle such things at a young age.

whenever an avoidant begins to feel dysphoric or even begins to have a cognition that will produce a dysphoric emotion they will do something to distract themselves and make them feel better. they may discontinue a task or fail to initiate a task they had planned to do. they may turn on the tv, reach for food or a cigarette, read a book, get up and pace up and down etc... they seek a diversion to push away the uncomfortable thoughts and feelings. in therapy when a therapist is trying to elicit the avoidant patients thoughts and uncomfortable feelings stemming from the avoidants beleifs, patients frequently ''shut down'' by changing the subject, standing up and walking around, or reporting that their minds have ''gone blank''.
this patern of cognitive and behavioural avoidance is reiforced by a reduction in dysphoria and so it eventually becomes ingrained and automatic.

CONCLUSION

Avoidant patients hold deep seated negative beleifs about themselves, others, and unpleasant emotional experiences. these beleifs often stem from childhood interactions with rejecting and critical significant persons. they see themselves as inadequate and worthless, others as critical and rejecting, and dysphoric emotions as overwhelming and intorerable.

socially they avoid situations in which other people could get close and discover the ''real'' them.
behaviourally they avoid tasks that would engender thoughts that make them feel uncomfortable.
cognitively they avoid thinking about matters that produce dysphoria. their tolerance for discomfort is low, and they rely on distractions whenever they begin to feel anxious, sad or bored


there are a lot of similarities between SA and AVPD but there is also a significant difference

similarities

social phobics and avoidants both fear social situations
social phobics and avoidants both feel self concious in social situations
social phobics and avoidants both use safety behaviours in social situations
social phobics and avoidants both avoid social situations

differences

*social phobics may only fear one or a few social situations were as avoidants fear every situation to some degree. even situations that they can torelate they are never truly comfortable in them
*even if the social phobia is the generalized type its still not as generalized as avpd because avpd covers everything from situation to self
*social phobics fear social situations for different reason than the avoidant fears them
*social phobics fear social situations becasue they fear being judged or evaluated negatively by others and they also worry that they will have a panic attack or that they will show physical symptoms such as blushing, shaking etc... wich will prove to be embarrassing
*avoidants fear social situations because they are worried that their real self will be exposed and they they will be rejected as a result of it
*social phobia is to do with fears about performing socially were as avoidant personality disorder is to do with fears about the self and about who you are as a person
*social phobics feel self concious in social situations becasue they are trying to prevent people noticing their symptoms such as blushing, shaking etc...
*avoidants are self concious in social situations cos they are preocupied with trying to hide their real selves, and doing their best not to lose themselves in the moment incase a part of their real self is reveal and that they will be rejected cos their real self is not acceptable
*social phobics safety behaviours are designed to hide physical symptoms of anxiety
*avoidant's saftey behaviours are designed to hide the real self
*avoidants also scan their environment in social situations looking for signs of rejection, ridicule and disaproval from others
*social phobics avoid social situations becasue of fears of having a panic attack or showing signs of anxiety or being embarrased
*avoidants also avoid social situations because of fears of being embarrassed but also becasue of fears of revelaing their selves and being rejected
*low self esteem goes hand in hand with avpd. avoidants have a low sense of self worth and beleive they are inferior and worthless
*social phobics dont nessecarily have low self worth. some might , some might not. social phobia is an anxiety disorder that is seperate to self worth. self worth may become an issue later on due to years of isolation but its a seperate issue to the actaull anxiety. the anxiety may be the casue of it but that doesnt make the slef worth a part of the anxiety
*avoidants not only avoid feared social situations but they also avoid negative feelings and even negative thoughts. they have a low threshold for discomfort/dysphoria. avoidants frequently procrastinate with even trivial everyday tasks such as getting out of bed, starting an exercise regime, brushing their teeth etc... this is not a feature of social anxiety
*social phobia is a fear of situations
*avpd is also a fear of situation but more so a fear of revealing the self

#169 Tovar

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 19:40

Piše li tu je li izlječivo(tu odakle si kopirao)? VanjaCro

#170 VanjaCro

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 20:11

View PostTovar, on 25 April 2017 - 19:40 , said:

Piše li tu je li izlječivo(tu odakle si kopirao)? VanjaCro
sa jedne stranice sam kopirao
ne pise nista da li je izljecivo vec samo razlika posto su SA i AvPD dosta slicni poremecaji pa se netko odlucio pozabaviti sa tim
a iskreno ono sto znam je da se SA moze ublaziti sa medikamentima, izlaganjem itd..... ali poremecaji osobnosti su na zalost trajni/dozivotni obrazac ponasanja za kojeg nema ljeka ali isto se tako primjenjuju medikamenti i ostale terapije radi ublazavanja simptoma i svakodnevnog mucenja
a za samu socijalnu anksioznost sam cuo da su neki ljudi jednostavno sveli simptome na nulu i funkcioniraju totalno normalno i zive zivot punim plucima
znaci poremecaji osobnosti = nema ljeka
socijalna anksioznost = ovisi od osobe do osobe no ishod je dosta dobar ako se krene sa terapijom sto ranije dok je osoba jos "teen" i dok nema totalno oformiranu osobnost
poanta je da se takvo ponasanje ne nastavi i u odrasloj dobi
ne zelim nikoga da plasim no vjerujem da svi koji imaju neki problem vec jako googlaju (sto je sasvim normalno u danasnje vrijeme posto se svi brinemo za svoje zdravlje i pitamo se wtf is wrong?) pa mogu i sami iskopati da kod poremecaja osobnosti nema spasa tako kazu sve literature nije da ovo izmisljam i nije da plasim nekoga vec iznosim sto se govori za PD's
a sada da li negdje tamo postoji netko tko se "izljecio" od poremecaja osobnosti nemam pojma

#171 Macak

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 20:29

Meni su u Vrapču dali dijagnozu trajni poremecaj osobnosti nakon katastrofalnih dogadjaja. Ne mogu reci da sam izlijecen iako sam vise puta bio siguran da toga vise nema. Imam "okidace" zbog kojih se pokrenu simptomi ali vise ne traju dugo. Polako ucim izbjeci okidace uz puno slabiju terapiju nego prije. Moze se i biti dobro, cak i sretan uz pogodjenu terapiju, tehnike opustanja i red u zivotu.

#172 secerlema

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 20:42

Ja sam sinoc umalo imala napad jer sam bila u gostima sa mojima, i bilo je previse ljudi i ja sam se skroz pogubila, uhvatila me panika, zelela sam bukvalno da se sklonim ispod stola i zamalo da zaplacem. Srecom tata je primetio, i rekao da moram da idem jer imam obaveza... Ja sam izjurila iz kuce, jedva se pozdravila sa domacinima, i morala sam da popijem lek da se smirim prvi put posle tri nedelje.

Ako su lekovi u necemu pomogli a to je da se ja osecam bolje u vezi sa sobom, da lakse podnosim dan ali problemi su i dalje tu. Ja se maltene ni sa kim ne druzim, na poslu izdrzavam jer imam samo jednog kolegu koji je srecom dobar covek i lako je raditi sa njim inace bi bio pakao. Imam problem da odlazem usmeni ispit jer jebeno ne mogu da se nateram da izadjem da pricam sa profesorom a ispit je bio spreman vec u januaru.


ovo sto Macak rece, red u zivotu, ja imam svoj red u zivotu, sad sam i produktivna ali sustinski bas nista nije reseno.

#173 Tovar

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 20:57

Na više sam mjesta pročitao da je to trajni obrazac i da nije moguć ozbiljniji pomak. U tom slučaju nema smislamučiti se dalje

#174 VanjaCro

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 21:10

a tako je to
ja sam isto tako kao dijete bio uzasno povucen i uopce nisam imao neku komunikaciju sa vrsnjacima i bum evo imam 30 god. i skoro mi je isti kurac weeeeeeee
par bliskih prijatelja je dovoljno no i to sam izgubio sto zbog problema a sto zbog toga sto i oni imaju svoje zivote i familiju i djecu
i samo sto nije bum i evo me na 40 i dalje citam ovaj forum a moj ne zivot ide dalje
de ti to sada objasni nekome tko ce shvatiti
ma nema sanse
ali pokusati makar pozitivno razmisljati i imati tu i tamo poneku nadu nije na odmet
shvacam iz osobnog iskustva da je tesko pokusati biti pozitivan uz takve probleme to je kao da kazem nekome da se izdere jace osobi koja je u potpunosti gluha da ga cuje
ovo sto je macak rekao stoji i moze se sve dovesti na neki nivo koji nije toliko bolan i da se zivi nekako i jebiga to je tako
to je zivot
zivot nikoga ne postedi pa cak niti zdrave
no ipak mislim kako ima nade za sve nas
glava gore i stit naprijed
rekoh stit naprijed ovaj svijet je nemilosrdan

#175 Macak

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 21:27

View PostTovar, on 25 April 2017 - 20:57 , said:

Na više sam mjesta pročitao da je to trajni obrazac i da nije moguć ozbiljniji pomak. U tom slučaju nema smisla mučiti se dalje
Ima smisla. Dok si živ ima nade da ćeš naći rješenja svojih problema. Možda boljeg doktora, bolju terapiju, neki novi izvor sreće.

A jesam, tvrdoglav ko tovar. Baš me tvoj nick podsjeti. Tko zna za šta je sve to dobro.


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